VBB 370 Rissa Miller: Why Owning Your Inner ‘Bitch’ Is Self-Love!

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Virgin, Beauty, Bitch, podcast, inspiring women to overcome social stereotypes and share unique

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life experiences without fear of being defiantly different.

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Your hosts, Christopher and Heather. Let's talk, shall we?

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Women who react with emotion to the word "bitch" are often quick to share why they feel

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so hurt, or enraged by the word. But few are able to see how needing to avoid being called

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a bitch keeps them from living their potential or allows them to appreciate their own value

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and worth as a woman.

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This isn't about laying blame, it's about awareness, learning how the very word that

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enrages or frightens women is also the key to their empowerment.

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If you're skeptical, that's good, but I would suggest also being curious as we welcome

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into our conversation folklorist, speaker, public historian, herbalist and diviner,

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Rissa Miller. Welcome back, Rissa, to Virgin, Beauty, Bitch.

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Thank you so much, Christopher, Heather, it's a pleasure to be back, I love this show.

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So we are always in get ready to learn mode whenever we talk with you.

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And once Heather and I realize that our shared gut belief from day one of this podcast, that

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bitch holds the potential for women's empowerment and now years later discovering that our belief

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is conveniently spelled out in the very word "bitch" as betrayal, identity, trust, change

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and healing, B.I.T.C.H.

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Our first thought was to reach out to women we know who have lived through these five principles

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and understand the potential they hold for women's empowerment.

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But the scary part is, the first word is Betrayal, which is always the beginning.

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What do you have to say around that word for you?

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Well, you know, I put a lot of thought into preparing for this podcast and I think that

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you can separate the trail into two categories.

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There are internal and external betrayals. The external betrayals are absolutely

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going to happen in life.

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I mean, if you are interacting with any other living being, they're going to happen and external

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betrayals make us not trust others.

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But I think the thing that I would really like to focus on are those internal betrayals,

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self-betrayal.

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Because my biggest personal betrayals in my life are not what others have done to me,

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but they are all the moments when I stayed small and basically shrunk myself to play it

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safe and probably my biggest victory as an adult have spent the reclaiming of myself

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from those small internal betrayals.

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This betrayal, what triggers that internal betrayal for you is, I mean, you're not, you

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would born to betray yourself.

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Of course, nobody was.

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Nobody is born to betray themselves.

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It is taught.

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It is taught to us to betray ourselves.

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And I think, I think it can apply to anyone and it absolutely does, but it applies to women

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in a very specific way.

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We are always taught to shrink to make other people comfortable.

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I'm not saying just to make men comfortable.

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I mean, others in general.

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I mean, I've seen people shrink to make a cat comfortable.

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So it's like this need to constantly please others, to ignore red flags, to ignore our own

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needs, to put everything in front of us and not ourselves.

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It's the feeling of everybody's cup before our own.

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And some of this is kindness and generosity.

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And then there's a spot where you have gone over the line into self-betrayal.

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And I think a lot of people don't like the word, bitch, because they're like, oh no, I

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identify with that kindness and generosity.

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Great, but also what about for yourself?

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What about your kindness and generosity to you so that you can continue to actually be

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kind and generous to other people?

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It's sort of like, you know, I think that it can be applied to almost every situation in

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life.

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It can be applied to relationships for sure.

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It can be applied to family.

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It can be applied to work.

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It can be applied to friends and community.

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There's so many moments throughout a day's course when so many people do these acts of self-betrayal.

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I have definitely done it and it is a huge learning curve to identify it and stop.

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But I think it is probably one of the greatest acts of self-care and self-love that you can

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do when you stop self-betraying.

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Thank you for outlining that because it's something that I've been thinking about a

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lot too in this process of going through the BITCH principles and these different elements

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or almost like different, as you said, types of betrayal.

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I love the external and internal that you said.

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And I think that, you know, part of what kind of hits home for me about what you shared

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there is that we've been taught to override our own instincts.

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So kind of to push through exhaustion to show up for your kids, for your partner, just

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as you said, put everyone else ahead of you or your needs because, you know, in many ways,

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the way that these structures have shaped us to said, this is the only way that you can

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survive.

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You have to show up for this, that, and the next thing before, you know, so that your kids

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are cared for, things that people that depend on you, which is, of course, counterintuitive

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to what you really need, which is, like you said, filling up your own, your own cup.

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And to me to, like, tap back into the body in a world that has taught us that you should

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reward disconnection from feeling your limits, from infealing your internal betrayal, your

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work in ritual and tea and smoke and presence, I think is such a beautiful way to bring back,

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you know, that, like, how we've disconnected from even knowing that a self-patrial is happening.

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So would you walk us through how your practices may have helped your own journey in that or

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the journey that you've helped other people with?

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I would.

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So it's interesting to say that I didn't identify this immediately in my life.

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It probably took into my forties to start recognizing it.

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And it wasn't that I had never heard of it at all.

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I mean, I remember being a recent college grad in my 20s and listening to Oprah talk

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about, you know, filling your cup for a store, you know, who's oxygen mask, you put on

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person in airplane.

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And I remember listening to that episode of Oprah and thinking like, oh, whatever, and going

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about my day.

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But I was already deeply entrenched in the process of self-patrial, you know, I can, I could

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tell you for sure I was already doing that in my 20s.

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And it is absolutely a learned behavior, especially in any kind of feminine identifying

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person.

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And it's sort of almost like we are expected to do it as part of our feminine identity.

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And like what you were saying in the beginning, like to be called a bitch is to be called

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selfish is to be called evil is to be called not loving.

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And I think that you hit a certain point in your life where you have been a doormat for

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enough people and enough situations, personal and professional, that you're kind of like,

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I am so done.

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I am so done with being a doormat.

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And finally, I think it was in my forties when I'm like, I finally understand what Oprah

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was talking about all those years ago.

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I got it.

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It didn't click for me for a long, long time.

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And you know, I think for me personally, it wasn't any of my rituals that it started with.

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It was like a truth I found in my body.

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And that is of course where intuition lives.

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Intuition actually, scientists tell us at least the most recent data that intuition lives

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in the microbiome of our gut, right?

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And that is where you have to learn to listen, not your head, because your head is where

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like anxiety and overthinking live.

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But what do you feel in your body?

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What is the truth that your body is sharing with you?

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And in those moments of actually listening to your body, you kind of know when you don't

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want to do something.

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Or you know when somebody is lying, or you know when something is literally about to go down

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the drain.

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Like you know it.

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And sometimes you go through with it anyway, because there's that self-patrailed, there's

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that learned behavior that we continue to engage in as a society.

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And I think women, especially your taught like, oh feminine intuition is silly, it's woo-woo.

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Is it?

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I don't think so.

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Because science is now proven that intuition is a real thing.

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Intuition is how our species made it, you know, out of running from bears into being a

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society.

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All of us have intuition no matter how you identify with gender.

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We're just taught not to listen to it.

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And I think that my intuitive practice has brought me back into my body more.

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As I got older, it was easier and easier to get into that place.

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And then it's interesting that you brought it up, Heather, because doing readings for other

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people, I could so easily identify when the person across from me was self abandoning.

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It was clear as day to me what was happening to them over and over.

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I have had particular clients who've come to me over the years and I'm here thinking

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like they're still doing it.

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They're still doing the thing that they said they were going to stop doing within the abusive

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relationship or the abusive job and they just can't walk away.

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They can't reach a place of sovereignty that makes them feel safe enough to get out of

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survival mode.

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And I think that there are a lot of cases to be made for surviving, of course, especially

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like the economy is crazy and the world feels really uncertain.

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But that's just it.

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The world is uncertain no matter how safe you try to feel your world can collapse in a

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minute.

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You can change on a dime.

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I mean, that happened to me recently when I fell down the stairs.

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I didn't know that was going to happen.

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I perceived that I was safe, but I was not.

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So safety is always in illusion.

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And the closer you get to sovereignty, the more you're able to accept that.

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But that said, allowing yourself to feel things in your body is not super easy and it's

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not super comfortable.

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So allowing your feelings to truly like sink down into your core into your gut, it can

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be a very uncomfortable process to get there.

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And nobody really wants to be uncomfortable.

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And I think that that's the biggest first hurdle for most people becoming aware of their own

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self betrayal.

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I think we spent an entire life learning how to be safe, perceived, safe and the channel

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that into being comfortable.

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So for women especially, when all of the survival is tied to your being loved, that is exceptionally

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difficult to turn your back on.

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It is.

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And I think a lot of women especially stay in incredibly destructive relationships and

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incredibly destructive dynamics in families and even jobs because they seek this validation

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that really needs to come from them first.

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And until they're able to let go of that need, they will never identify their self betrayal.

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They'll never see it no matter how clearly a therapist see it or their friends see it

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or their mom sees it or their terror reader sees it, they won't see it until they're ready

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to.

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And I mean, for me, it took going through a period of incredible loss to sort of step back and

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be like, none of those things were real.

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Like I couldn't hold on to any of them.

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And some of them, I went through a really difficult period a few years ago where I went through

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a divorce.

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I dealt with the death of several people.

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I was close to all it wants.

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I lost my dog, like, I lost a job.

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All of these things happened bang, bang, bang in a row.

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And there was no comfort.

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There was no easy way out.

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And I had to step back and catch my breath.

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And I realized how impermanent they were to begin with.

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And how, I mean, we could, we could flip this and be like, you know, every time something's

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good, be grateful, but also understand that it's not forever.

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Nothing is, none of us are.

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So finding your power is a moment of clarity that I wish for all women and finding your

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sovereignty and your voice to take authorship of your own life.

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And you know, I know I wrote when we were emailing, I told you a story about my Pilates coach.

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And I want to share that story because it's so telling of exactly what I mean.

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So even recently, even though I already have learned these lessons, it's important to

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keep learning them.

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I a few months ago, I was in a Pilates session and my coach, Jillian, is an awesome lady,

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said to me, you are stronger and more flexible than you allow yourself to be.

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And she's like, did you know that?

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And I said, no, what do you mean?

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And I was intimidated to start Pilates anyway because it's on this reformer that looks sort

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of like a medieval torture device, right?

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It has all these ropes and pulleys and things that slide.

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And I was completely out of my comfort zone.

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But we were several sessions in and the equipment wasn't what was holding me back.

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I was holding me back.

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And she's like, you know, just allow yourself to drop into the stretch and use gravity.

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And when I did, I found that I could go like a foot deeper into the stretch than I was

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letting myself.

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And I was actually like she said, way stronger.

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I could handle way more resistance than I was allowing.

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And I sat there and I thought about it and it sort of unlocked the question, where else

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am I limiting myself in my life?

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Where else am I limiting?

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My strength and my flexibility.

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And the next time I'm back, I was like, I have to thank you because you gave me a really

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acute awareness that my body was reflecting what I was doing professionally to myself.

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And the body will always tell you.

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It will always tell you what's going on.

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You just have to listen.

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And sometimes it's somebody with that outside awareness like Jillian in that moment that

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will really show you where you are giving away your power.

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That ties so well into the concept of identity because I think that a piece of our identity

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is the limitations that we either self-inflicted because they're internalized or real limitations

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that society has placed on us, often that's internalized and then becomes a self-fulfilling

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prophecy.

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And I think that when I have those things in mind, it seems that we've identified in some

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of the episodes on here that for so long, a woman's identity was relational because they

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were a mother, because they were a partner, that that was their core identity.

230
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So when something happens, like you just outlined where maybe one of those relationships is

231
00:15:44,220 --> 00:15:51,380
severed, you have to look yourself square in the face to say, who am I without these relations?

232
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Who am I?

233
00:15:52,900 --> 00:15:58,460
Or I got attached to the concept of that these people or this job or this piece actually

234
00:15:58,460 --> 00:16:02,340
is who I am when all of those things can fade away.

235
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The one thing that doesn't as long as we have the consciousness and mental capacity to

236
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sense it, you will always have yourself in this lifetime.

237
00:16:15,420 --> 00:16:20,620
We just had a show talking about what it would mean to get closer with yourself.

238
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So I think that when whether it's your job or saying that I have to achieve something in

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order to own my sovereignty, or I have to have this that and the next thing in order to

240
00:16:31,260 --> 00:16:36,580
know that I'm secure and safe and stable and often life shakes it up and says that, "Ha,

241
00:16:36,580 --> 00:16:37,580
ha, guess what?

242
00:16:37,580 --> 00:16:39,100
We're going to put a wrench in that."

243
00:16:39,100 --> 00:16:46,180
I think that presence is and sovereignty is not something that you earn, but something

244
00:16:46,180 --> 00:16:48,420
that you already inhabit.

245
00:16:48,420 --> 00:16:53,740
And so you've already chatted quite a bit about how that process happened for you and a

246
00:16:53,740 --> 00:17:00,820
big bunch of sequences happening at a very close timeframe that helps you to really see

247
00:17:00,820 --> 00:17:02,620
that moment.

248
00:17:02,620 --> 00:17:08,420
In your work with other people, are there aspects of the work that you do now that you feel

249
00:17:08,420 --> 00:17:15,020
help people to pause maybe perhaps before something really big kind of snacks you in the

250
00:17:15,020 --> 00:17:18,420
face and says, "You know, there's more to it than what we're doing."

251
00:17:18,420 --> 00:17:19,420
Yes.

252
00:17:19,420 --> 00:17:21,620
And there's actually something else you said I want to address as well.

253
00:17:21,620 --> 00:17:26,940
I think that one of the reasons, historically, that so much was tied to a partnership or

254
00:17:26,940 --> 00:17:34,680
a job is because looking back over time, whoever you married determined your ability to go

255
00:17:34,680 --> 00:17:36,500
forward in the world.

256
00:17:36,500 --> 00:17:42,580
Now, if a woman didn't marry historically, and I don't mean like a few years ago, I mean

257
00:17:42,580 --> 00:17:47,780
hundreds of years ago, or even a hundred years ago, her ability, she couldn't get a house,

258
00:17:47,780 --> 00:17:51,100
she couldn't have properties, she couldn't get credit, she couldn't open a bank account

259
00:17:51,100 --> 00:17:56,140
to win banks were real, none of those things were possible to women without a father or a

260
00:17:56,140 --> 00:17:57,580
husband.

261
00:17:57,580 --> 00:18:02,660
And it is something that is still lingering in our society today.

262
00:18:02,660 --> 00:18:08,140
Even though we have come past that, we haven't let go of it mentally yet.

263
00:18:08,140 --> 00:18:14,820
It is a mental contract, it is not a thing that's real anymore, thankfully in most societies,

264
00:18:14,820 --> 00:18:17,780
not everyone, not everyone in the world has that privilege.

265
00:18:17,780 --> 00:18:20,700
But where we are, we do, we have that privilege.

266
00:18:20,700 --> 00:18:23,940
We no longer need a husband or a father to get a house.

267
00:18:23,940 --> 00:18:27,060
We no longer need a husband or father to open a bank account.

268
00:18:27,060 --> 00:18:31,420
And how wonderful, because some of that happened within my lifetime.

269
00:18:31,420 --> 00:18:38,860
And I think that it's time for women to be okay with signing their own name and being their

270
00:18:38,860 --> 00:18:42,500
own, you know, how do I want to say this?

271
00:18:42,500 --> 00:18:47,780
Their own leader in their life, the author of their own life, the person who determines

272
00:18:47,780 --> 00:18:50,780
what their dreams are going to be.

273
00:18:50,780 --> 00:18:56,420
And your other question, when I see it in other people, you can, it's kind of like the old

274
00:18:56,420 --> 00:18:58,420
expression about leading a horse to water.

275
00:18:58,420 --> 00:19:02,420
You can only lead the person to the idea of self-sovereignty.

276
00:19:02,420 --> 00:19:04,260
You can't make them embrace it.

277
00:19:04,260 --> 00:19:05,460
You can show it.

278
00:19:05,460 --> 00:19:08,220
You can say here's the mirror, but that's it.

279
00:19:08,220 --> 00:19:10,220
That's all you can offer to someone.

280
00:19:10,220 --> 00:19:13,220
Kind of like when I sell it on Oprah, I wasn't ready to hear it.

281
00:19:13,220 --> 00:19:16,900
I had to, I had to get into the place in my life where I was ready to hear it.

282
00:19:16,900 --> 00:19:19,180
And some of that means slowing down.

283
00:19:19,180 --> 00:19:23,220
Because when I went through all those big losses in my life at the same time, everything

284
00:19:23,220 --> 00:19:25,540
came to a stop.

285
00:19:25,540 --> 00:19:27,500
Everything.

286
00:19:27,500 --> 00:19:32,980
Like it was a big deal for me at that point in time to, you know, shower and make food.

287
00:19:32,980 --> 00:19:35,660
Because I was so deeply immersed in grief.

288
00:19:35,660 --> 00:19:41,740
But it did cost me all of those different identities at the same time.

289
00:19:41,740 --> 00:19:45,820
And it cost me the identity of granddaughter because I lost both of my grandparents within

290
00:19:45,820 --> 00:19:46,820
a year.

291
00:19:46,820 --> 00:19:50,380
It cost me the identity of the job I had where I worked at a museum.

292
00:19:50,380 --> 00:19:53,980
And I loved being at that museum, but that job was gone.

293
00:19:53,980 --> 00:19:55,700
They eliminated the position.

294
00:19:55,700 --> 00:19:57,500
So I no longer had that identity.

295
00:19:57,500 --> 00:20:03,460
And I know when I left the jobs where I had titles like senior editor or things like that,

296
00:20:03,460 --> 00:20:07,740
it's really difficult to let go of that identity because you feel like it's an achievement.

297
00:20:07,740 --> 00:20:11,140
And it does know less of an achievement if you leave it.

298
00:20:11,140 --> 00:20:12,700
It's still your achievement.

299
00:20:12,700 --> 00:20:17,980
And you still have all the same skills that you, you had before.

300
00:20:17,980 --> 00:20:25,300
And it did take me a while to understand that when I let go of those names and those places.

301
00:20:25,300 --> 00:20:29,900
But when you're dealing with anybody besides yourself, you have to let them find it on

302
00:20:29,900 --> 00:20:30,900
their own.

303
00:20:30,900 --> 00:20:36,420
You can, you know, you can drop, you can drop hints, but that's about it in my experience.

304
00:20:36,420 --> 00:20:42,460
Having an alter identity is sexy, right?

305
00:20:42,460 --> 00:20:45,260
You are this like a spy.

306
00:20:45,260 --> 00:20:46,260
That's sexy stuff.

307
00:20:46,260 --> 00:20:47,260
That is sexy.

308
00:20:47,260 --> 00:20:48,260
Yeah.

309
00:20:48,260 --> 00:20:49,260
Yeah.

310
00:20:49,260 --> 00:20:54,580
Having an identity of someone that you have struggled with your whole life, which is yourself.

311
00:20:54,580 --> 00:21:00,180
It's not sexy.

312
00:21:00,180 --> 00:21:06,860
You know, I, one of the other hats I wear and I, sometimes I talk about it a lot and sometimes

313
00:21:06,860 --> 00:21:08,980
I don't, is poet.

314
00:21:08,980 --> 00:21:15,700
And one of the hardest poetry classes I took, we had to write a love poem to ourself.

315
00:21:15,700 --> 00:21:17,900
And I don't have the poem in front of me.

316
00:21:17,900 --> 00:21:19,300
I wish I had pulled it.

317
00:21:19,300 --> 00:21:27,180
I wrote a poem where I, I used my name as the catalyst for writing the love poem to myself.

318
00:21:27,180 --> 00:21:30,420
And I remember the first time I read it in front of people.

319
00:21:30,420 --> 00:21:31,780
Now I'm not shy.

320
00:21:31,780 --> 00:21:37,060
I speak in front of a hundred people like it's nothing, but reading a poem about myself

321
00:21:37,060 --> 00:21:42,780
and saying my name in like a slow sexy per felt incredibly uncomfortable.

322
00:21:42,780 --> 00:21:47,420
I definitely had a moment where I was like, I am having a poster syndrome.

323
00:21:47,420 --> 00:21:53,980
And I don't usually get that because I would definitely say that I'm confident and I love

324
00:21:53,980 --> 00:21:55,540
talking to groups.

325
00:21:55,540 --> 00:22:03,140
But standing in front of a group and, you know, making yourself out to be fabulous is a scary

326
00:22:03,140 --> 00:22:04,740
thing to do.

327
00:22:04,740 --> 00:22:09,700
That's the essence of bitch, right?

328
00:22:09,700 --> 00:22:10,700
Absolutely.

329
00:22:10,700 --> 00:22:13,900
That's the essence of it and not just keeping it to yourself.

330
00:22:13,900 --> 00:22:17,020
But that's, that's difficult.

331
00:22:17,020 --> 00:22:19,300
Okay, so we've talked about identity.

332
00:22:19,300 --> 00:22:25,820
I think the next obvious step is when did you finally, and I'm sure the, the spades in and

333
00:22:25,820 --> 00:22:33,020
out, it's not constant, but when did you reach a plateau of trust in yourself?

334
00:22:33,020 --> 00:22:34,020
Self trust.

335
00:22:34,020 --> 00:22:35,020
Yeah.

336
00:22:35,020 --> 00:22:41,020
Because it is that internal betrayal that erodes self trust.

337
00:22:41,020 --> 00:22:44,860
And I think that everybody is familiar with that.

338
00:22:44,860 --> 00:22:51,580
They're not, they want to admit it because we all allow that erosion to occur.

339
00:22:51,580 --> 00:22:54,100
I've learned to listen to it in my body.

340
00:22:54,100 --> 00:23:00,220
Honestly, when I feel that funny nudge in my gut or just that feeling that something's

341
00:23:00,220 --> 00:23:03,100
not quite right, I pull back and examine.

342
00:23:03,100 --> 00:23:07,900
And I allow myself into self awareness that I didn't use to do.

343
00:23:07,900 --> 00:23:11,900
I used to just blow it off and like, oh, I'm overthinking it because that's, that's

344
00:23:11,900 --> 00:23:12,900
a real thing too.

345
00:23:12,900 --> 00:23:15,340
People can over think situations.

346
00:23:15,340 --> 00:23:19,340
And then, you know, I was just talking to a friend this morning who things are going right

347
00:23:19,340 --> 00:23:20,420
for her.

348
00:23:20,420 --> 00:23:23,580
And she was like, I keep waiting for something bad to happen.

349
00:23:23,580 --> 00:23:27,980
And it's like, maybe it's okay for everything to go right as well.

350
00:23:27,980 --> 00:23:31,140
You know, because we're also taught like, oh, there's going to be bad stuff.

351
00:23:31,140 --> 00:23:34,980
And yeah, there is, but also, what if everything goes right?

352
00:23:34,980 --> 00:23:37,220
Can you accept that too?

353
00:23:37,220 --> 00:23:41,500
And I think that's another spot where people begin to erode themselves.

354
00:23:41,500 --> 00:23:42,980
They're not there or aware of it.

355
00:23:42,980 --> 00:23:47,380
Like, we're taught to create an atmosphere where we self sabotage our own happiness and

356
00:23:47,380 --> 00:23:51,500
our own awareness in order to keep being small.

357
00:23:51,500 --> 00:23:53,460
And I think that's kind of the essence of the bitch.

358
00:23:53,460 --> 00:23:54,980
She refuses to stay small.

359
00:23:54,980 --> 00:23:58,020
She's like, I am here to take up space.

360
00:23:58,020 --> 00:24:04,300
And it is my, it have, how about I say, it is your privilege to be in the space with me.

361
00:24:04,300 --> 00:24:06,780
Ooh, yes, quote of the bitch.

362
00:24:06,780 --> 00:24:10,900
Ooh, that's like quote of the day.

363
00:24:10,900 --> 00:24:14,220
Maybe of the year, I love it.

364
00:24:14,220 --> 00:24:19,100
I just want to hone back in on something that you said, because it really hit me, you know,

365
00:24:19,100 --> 00:24:24,180
writing a love poem to yourself and speaking in front of a crowd of people and speaking highly

366
00:24:24,180 --> 00:24:33,420
of yourself, speaking as you are a fabulous being and just how challenging that is for so

367
00:24:33,420 --> 00:24:34,820
many women.

368
00:24:34,820 --> 00:24:40,700
And when I think about the roots of that feeling, you know, at least for me, it comes to, you

369
00:24:40,700 --> 00:24:51,220
know, like the exhaustion of being humble, wanting to, you know, it's very much tied to a virtue

370
00:24:51,220 --> 00:24:53,140
in being humble.

371
00:24:53,140 --> 00:24:58,940
And it is so much so that instead of it being about that, it's the roots have taken such

372
00:24:58,940 --> 00:25:05,540
a deeper, deeper, I don't know, plow into the core of the earth that, you know, it's eroded

373
00:25:05,540 --> 00:25:09,620
our ability to even think highly of ourselves.

374
00:25:09,620 --> 00:25:15,540
And agree, maybe we do on the inside, but to be able to articulate that to other people,

375
00:25:15,540 --> 00:25:18,660
you know, when I picture doing that, I completely agree.

376
00:25:18,660 --> 00:25:24,540
It would be so uncomfortable because then you're seen as self-serving, you know, that

377
00:25:24,540 --> 00:25:27,700
you're seen as, oh, wow, she must think she is, you know, shit, hot.

378
00:25:27,700 --> 00:25:30,340
And who does she think she is?

379
00:25:30,340 --> 00:25:33,260
And how much of that has been conditioned into women?

380
00:25:33,260 --> 00:25:34,260
There it is.

381
00:25:34,260 --> 00:25:42,700
I was, as you were talking, I was picturing these three boys in middle school talking about

382
00:25:42,700 --> 00:25:44,740
another girl, and I was standing behind them.

383
00:25:44,740 --> 00:25:48,940
I could hear the whole thing saying she's a big feeling bitch.

384
00:25:48,940 --> 00:25:53,940
And at the time, I had to take it in context because it was the first time I remember hearing

385
00:25:53,940 --> 00:25:55,420
that phrase.

386
00:25:55,420 --> 00:25:59,220
And I remember thinking like, what are those things have to do with themselves?

387
00:25:59,220 --> 00:26:02,220
What is having big feelings to do with being a bitch?

388
00:26:02,220 --> 00:26:06,500
And over the years, of course, I've heard that expression many, many more times.

389
00:26:06,500 --> 00:26:12,500
And I have to step back and be like, hey, I don't actually, I've been called a bitch many

390
00:26:12,500 --> 00:26:13,500
times.

391
00:26:13,500 --> 00:26:15,380
It'll happen again, and I'm totally fine with it.

392
00:26:15,380 --> 00:26:17,980
There are times that I've actually said thank you.

393
00:26:17,980 --> 00:26:21,260
And what is wrong with having big feelings?

394
00:26:21,260 --> 00:26:25,620
You know, we're taught to keep our feelings suppressed and small and to choke them back

395
00:26:25,620 --> 00:26:27,220
why.

396
00:26:27,220 --> 00:26:28,980
And I don't think it's fair.

397
00:26:28,980 --> 00:26:30,820
I don't think it's appropriate.

398
00:26:30,820 --> 00:26:37,100
And obviously there are ways we interact to remain, you know, civil in society, but also

399
00:26:37,100 --> 00:26:41,300
there's nothing wrong with having big feelings, especially about yourself.

400
00:26:41,300 --> 00:26:48,180
And to reflect again on having to read that poem, I have come to love that poem.

401
00:26:48,180 --> 00:26:53,580
It's never been in any of my published work, but I often begin my poetry sets now with

402
00:26:53,580 --> 00:26:59,180
that poem because I feel like it's the best way for people in a crowd who don't know me

403
00:26:59,180 --> 00:27:01,620
to get to know who I am.

404
00:27:01,620 --> 00:27:06,740
It's a little sexier than most of my other writing, but that was the whole idea, you know, it

405
00:27:06,740 --> 00:27:12,460
was like embracing the things about you that you think are worthy and beautiful.

406
00:27:12,460 --> 00:27:19,540
And it surprised me when I wrote it because I, in it, I talk about how I'm no longer hiding,

407
00:27:19,540 --> 00:27:25,900
how I am okay with being seen and I am okay with being who I am and what I look like.

408
00:27:25,900 --> 00:27:28,540
And if you don't like it, there's the door.

409
00:27:28,540 --> 00:27:32,380
So, yeah, sorry, I kind of got rambling there.

410
00:27:32,380 --> 00:27:36,860
There is another thing that's self-abandoned, that whole apology for talking about it.

411
00:27:36,860 --> 00:27:37,860
And there you go.

412
00:27:37,860 --> 00:27:42,100
That rambling was not, you know, not, it got so much out of that.

413
00:27:42,100 --> 00:27:50,860
You spoke about emotions and why men are so abhorred with women's emotions is because

414
00:27:50,860 --> 00:27:54,300
men are conditioned not to express emotions.

415
00:27:54,300 --> 00:27:59,340
It's like a fountain effect, right?

416
00:27:59,340 --> 00:28:01,340
It starts at the top and just dribbles down.

417
00:28:01,340 --> 00:28:03,260
So, it impacts everyone in society.

418
00:28:03,260 --> 00:28:09,900
When you tell a boy not to show any emotions, because that's how he shows strength is not

419
00:28:09,900 --> 00:28:11,820
to show any emotion.

420
00:28:11,820 --> 00:28:12,820
That just trickles down.

421
00:28:12,820 --> 00:28:16,220
Now, as a boy, I'm not going to take that from a girl.

422
00:28:16,220 --> 00:28:20,980
I just transfer what it is up and told is right to you.

423
00:28:20,980 --> 00:28:23,420
So, you're not allowed to do it either.

424
00:28:23,420 --> 00:28:26,300
Unfortunately, that's the cycle.

425
00:28:26,300 --> 00:28:28,300
And you know, history shows this this again.

426
00:28:28,300 --> 00:28:33,500
It holds up this mirror of the time when women had hysteria or were hysterical and were

427
00:28:33,500 --> 00:28:40,420
literally put into asylums because they couldn't contain their emotions.

428
00:28:40,420 --> 00:28:44,500
And they were also put in if they learned how to read or were too educated as well because

429
00:28:44,500 --> 00:28:46,220
that's not safe either.

430
00:28:46,220 --> 00:28:50,700
You know, a woman with an opinion who is willing to express it, ultimately a bitch, isn't

431
00:28:50,700 --> 00:28:51,700
safe.

432
00:28:51,700 --> 00:28:54,580
Of course, we don't want her circulating in society.

433
00:28:54,580 --> 00:28:58,380
Big feelings, big brain, tuck her away.

434
00:28:58,380 --> 00:29:05,700
But yeah, history has shown us over and over again that women who are sovereign are dangerous.

435
00:29:05,700 --> 00:29:12,620
That women who have the ability to articulate their feelings, who are intelligent, who are

436
00:29:12,620 --> 00:29:17,260
able to communicate and learn are dangerous.

437
00:29:17,260 --> 00:29:21,300
Ultimately, bitches that can't be trusted.

438
00:29:21,300 --> 00:29:24,260
Their women, unfortunately, reflect this too.

439
00:29:24,260 --> 00:29:33,660
It is a sad thing to me that I remember being told when I was a child, stay in your place.

440
00:29:33,660 --> 00:29:37,260
As if don't overexpress, don't have too many opinions.

441
00:29:37,260 --> 00:29:40,860
And of course, I have long since abandoned those ideas.

442
00:29:40,860 --> 00:29:46,180
But it was definitely from the grandparents' generations because that's how they were raised.

443
00:29:46,180 --> 00:29:51,940
They were raised that it is not acceptable for a woman to express themselves and take

444
00:29:51,940 --> 00:29:54,420
of space and to have big opinions.

445
00:29:54,420 --> 00:29:56,420
Be seen, not be heard.

446
00:29:56,420 --> 00:29:57,420
Exactly.

447
00:29:57,420 --> 00:29:58,420
And be pretty.

448
00:29:58,420 --> 00:30:05,020
I think when I think about change as the C and BITCH in our conversation that we're having,

449
00:30:05,020 --> 00:30:09,780
the biggest thing that's ringing true for me is that that change is really all about

450
00:30:09,780 --> 00:30:10,780
these moments.

451
00:30:10,780 --> 00:30:14,700
And I'm not saying it has to be one big moment, although it could be the catalyst.

452
00:30:14,700 --> 00:30:18,540
And she no longer tolerates abandoning herself.

453
00:30:18,540 --> 00:30:19,540
Yes.

454
00:30:19,540 --> 00:30:20,540
Yes.

455
00:30:20,540 --> 00:30:21,540
Absolutely.

456
00:30:21,540 --> 00:30:24,580
When I was preparing for this, I actually wrote that down.

457
00:30:24,580 --> 00:30:30,660
There is a moment where most women will identify whether they're using the word self-betrayal

458
00:30:30,660 --> 00:30:34,220
or not, self-abendement or not, they understand the feeling.

459
00:30:34,220 --> 00:30:35,940
They know that it's been happening.

460
00:30:35,940 --> 00:30:38,060
And there's a part of them that's like, "I am fed up.

461
00:30:38,060 --> 00:30:39,060
I am done.

462
00:30:39,060 --> 00:30:44,660
I will not tolerate one more thing of crap from my boss, from my partner, from my child

463
00:30:44,660 --> 00:30:46,660
from my neighbor, whoever it might be."

464
00:30:46,660 --> 00:30:49,260
They're just like, "Enough."

465
00:30:49,260 --> 00:30:54,700
And in that moment, she might feel like a bitch, but it was always in her.

466
00:30:54,700 --> 00:30:57,500
And it's kind of always been part of her.

467
00:30:57,500 --> 00:31:00,860
And finally, she's expressing herself fully.

468
00:31:00,860 --> 00:31:03,060
Thank you for that.

469
00:31:03,060 --> 00:31:07,580
That is the essence of what Heather and I believe.

470
00:31:07,580 --> 00:31:11,580
The BITCH, you are the BITCH.

471
00:31:11,580 --> 00:31:13,460
It's part of you.

472
00:31:13,460 --> 00:31:19,860
It is a big part of you that you have been told you need to put in like a genie in a bottle

473
00:31:19,860 --> 00:31:21,460
and cork it.

474
00:31:21,460 --> 00:31:22,460
Keep it away.

475
00:31:22,460 --> 00:31:24,380
Because that powers too much.

476
00:31:24,380 --> 00:31:26,380
You got to put that thing away.

477
00:31:26,380 --> 00:31:27,380
Absolutely.

478
00:31:27,380 --> 00:31:28,380
Absolutely.

479
00:31:28,380 --> 00:31:29,380
Yeah.

480
00:31:29,380 --> 00:31:32,020
Well, it's like I said, history shows us this over and over.

481
00:31:32,020 --> 00:31:36,740
I mean, how many ways have women been suppressed, whether you want to talk about corsets, or

482
00:31:36,740 --> 00:31:40,220
you want to talk about a silence or you want to talk about how women should not be

483
00:31:40,220 --> 00:31:43,420
heard only seen in their beauty?

484
00:31:43,420 --> 00:31:46,260
There are a million ways we could talk about that.

485
00:31:46,260 --> 00:31:51,660
And I think it's a place for us to land now in healing.

486
00:31:51,660 --> 00:31:56,580
You know, when you have had that moment or moments of I've had enough, I'm fed up.

487
00:31:56,580 --> 00:32:01,340
I'm not going to abandon myself anymore and there's got to be a better way and I can

488
00:32:01,340 --> 00:32:04,100
feel it in me.

489
00:32:04,100 --> 00:32:12,740
And I think in our chat today, we've talked about different elements of healing and sometimes

490
00:32:12,740 --> 00:32:15,020
that sensuality and feeling sexy.

491
00:32:15,020 --> 00:32:20,420
Like you talked about that beautiful poem as more sexy than some of your other poetry work,

492
00:32:20,420 --> 00:32:23,900
which I think is such a strong power source for women.

493
00:32:23,900 --> 00:32:29,280
But if you could share with us, you know, elements or modalities or things that you've found

494
00:32:29,280 --> 00:32:34,300
helpful in your healing, that would be very illuminating.

495
00:32:34,300 --> 00:32:38,140
So there are many paths that I've taken to healing over the years.

496
00:32:38,140 --> 00:32:40,260
Therapy is definitely one of them.

497
00:32:40,260 --> 00:32:45,460
And I will be honest, I've only ever talked to female therapists in my life because I feel

498
00:32:45,460 --> 00:32:51,220
like they will identify them with me in a way that a man might not be able to.

499
00:32:51,220 --> 00:32:55,820
And journaling has been a big source of healing for me, especially when I can look back over

500
00:32:55,820 --> 00:33:00,460
journals and see who I was and who I've become.

501
00:33:00,460 --> 00:33:08,540
Looking at old pictures of myself, realizing that when I was a 95 pound 18 year old and

502
00:33:08,540 --> 00:33:16,540
somebody convinced me I was still overweight, was ridiculous, simply crazy.

503
00:33:16,540 --> 00:33:21,060
And looking back at old pictures of myself in different parts of my life, I have learned

504
00:33:21,060 --> 00:33:23,940
to love who I was in so many different phases.

505
00:33:23,940 --> 00:33:28,540
From like the funny little girl who like to play in laundry baskets to the person I've become

506
00:33:28,540 --> 00:33:32,660
that I actually really like being photographed now, I'm super comfortable in front of the

507
00:33:32,660 --> 00:33:37,820
camera and I never thought I would be in this place, especially in my 50s.

508
00:33:37,820 --> 00:33:48,900
And I think that overall embracing the wholeness of yourself, the bitch is about becoming

509
00:33:48,900 --> 00:33:54,500
everything you already were and you were afraid of that you were afraid was too much, was too

510
00:33:54,500 --> 00:34:02,700
big, was too emotional, was too smart, was any of those things, was too flamboyant, do

511
00:34:02,700 --> 00:34:04,540
it anyway.

512
00:34:04,540 --> 00:34:10,060
My last story I'll share with you, I was in a thrift shop, a friend of mine owned a thrift

513
00:34:10,060 --> 00:34:15,940
shop and she had the best clothes and a woman came in who she was a widow and she found out

514
00:34:15,940 --> 00:34:24,380
that she had terminal cancer and she was buying every sparkly top in the place and I talked

515
00:34:24,380 --> 00:34:27,980
to people all the time in the world and so I asked her, I was like, oh do you have an occasion?

516
00:34:27,980 --> 00:34:32,340
She's like, yeah, I'm still alive and I've always wanted to wear sparkly sequins tops

517
00:34:32,340 --> 00:34:37,540
and I never did it because everybody told me they were tacky and too loud and too flashy

518
00:34:37,540 --> 00:34:40,980
and she's like, I found out I have cancer that I've less than a year to live.

519
00:34:40,980 --> 00:34:45,060
She's like, I got rid of my sensible car and I bought her by convertible and she's like

520
00:34:45,060 --> 00:34:49,380
and now I'm buying every sparkly top I can find and it's all I plan to wear for the rest

521
00:34:49,380 --> 00:34:50,380
of my days.

522
00:34:50,380 --> 00:34:54,820
And so I immediately stopped what I was doing and helped her find tops in her size that

523
00:34:54,820 --> 00:35:00,620
were sparkly or glittery or had sequins and I felt like we were friends till she left

524
00:35:00,620 --> 00:35:08,060
and I thought how incredibly a brave that she was finally doing it but sad that she listened

525
00:35:08,060 --> 00:35:14,300
to people about what it was okay to drive or wear for her whole life till she told me she

526
00:35:14,300 --> 00:35:23,180
was 67 and that now she was going to finally end her life complete but all 67 of those years

527
00:35:23,180 --> 00:35:28,020
she could have been wearing her sparkly tops and loving them and being who she was.

528
00:35:28,020 --> 00:35:33,500
So don't wait, don't wait to wear this sparkly tops, don't wait to drive the right convertible.

529
00:35:33,500 --> 00:35:40,500
Just go do it, just go be your wild, crazy bitchy self and enjoy it.

530
00:35:40,500 --> 00:35:41,500
I love that.

531
00:35:41,500 --> 00:35:42,500
Thank you for that.

532
00:35:42,500 --> 00:35:43,500
This is perfect.

533
00:35:43,500 --> 00:35:46,500
This is absolutely perfect.

534
00:35:46,500 --> 00:35:47,780
This is not advice.

535
00:35:47,780 --> 00:35:56,140
I would say as far as therapy goes, I think what works with this podcast is that we talk

536
00:35:56,140 --> 00:35:57,140
about feminine.

537
00:35:57,140 --> 00:36:01,820
We talk about women's lives and what they go through.

538
00:36:01,820 --> 00:36:08,260
However, I think what really brings it to life is having two perspectives, having a male

539
00:36:08,260 --> 00:36:11,180
perspective and a female perspective.

540
00:36:11,180 --> 00:36:16,580
So even though I'm sure you feel more comfortable in the presence of a woman when it comes to your

541
00:36:16,580 --> 00:36:24,940
personal, sharing that personal life, you might be surprised that a man might bring a

542
00:36:24,940 --> 00:36:29,940
little bit of a woman, but that's some sort of thing that you may not ever experience a

543
00:36:29,940 --> 00:36:33,980
thought of from the perspective of his experiences.

544
00:36:33,980 --> 00:36:34,980
Right?

545
00:36:34,980 --> 00:36:42,060
So I'll just introduce that softly.

546
00:36:42,060 --> 00:36:49,380
You don't have to do that softly for me, but I'm sure you're completely correct and at

547
00:36:49,380 --> 00:36:51,460
some point maybe I'll be ready to explore that.

548
00:36:51,460 --> 00:36:53,460
But it has to be the right gentleman.

549
00:36:53,460 --> 00:36:56,300
It always has to be the right therapist in general.

550
00:36:56,300 --> 00:37:01,380
I appreciate the shout out though, Christopher, because I think, you know, I resonate with what

551
00:37:01,380 --> 00:37:08,540
you shared, Risa, that I've also only had women identified persons as my therapist, but,

552
00:37:08,540 --> 00:37:14,540
you know, shout out for the guys, Christopher, because, you know, it's such a treat, honestly,

553
00:37:14,540 --> 00:37:19,080
what Christopher brings to each and every one of these conversations and to have the

554
00:37:19,080 --> 00:37:24,960
masculine here in these conversations for me is it's the yin and yang, right?

555
00:37:24,960 --> 00:37:28,080
It's the yin and yang of what we do, the yin and yang of life.

556
00:37:28,080 --> 00:37:30,800
So thank you for raising it, Christopher.

557
00:37:30,800 --> 00:37:31,800
We possess both.

558
00:37:31,800 --> 00:37:36,760
We're just conditioned to only use one side of our body because the other side fell down

559
00:37:36,760 --> 00:37:37,760
the stairs.

560
00:37:37,760 --> 00:37:38,760
Right.

561
00:37:38,760 --> 00:37:43,360
And then society like kicked her when she was down.

562
00:37:43,360 --> 00:37:44,360
Yeah.

563
00:37:44,360 --> 00:37:47,360
Thankfully that didn't happen physically too.

564
00:37:47,360 --> 00:37:48,360
Right.

565
00:37:48,360 --> 00:37:49,360
Right.

566
00:37:49,360 --> 00:37:50,840
Metaphorically to the feminine.

567
00:37:50,840 --> 00:37:53,680
We have kicked her while she was down.

568
00:37:53,680 --> 00:37:59,840
Rissa, it is always such, we always so look forward to speaking with you.

569
00:37:59,840 --> 00:38:05,080
It is such a pleasure to have you in our little family that we have.

570
00:38:05,080 --> 00:38:06,080
It really is.

571
00:38:06,080 --> 00:38:08,160
We totally love talking to you.

572
00:38:08,160 --> 00:38:09,600
And I love talking to both of you.

573
00:38:09,600 --> 00:38:12,360
I'm glad to be part of your family.

574
00:38:12,360 --> 00:38:14,200
But so many times.

575
00:38:14,200 --> 00:38:19,680
It's so true that how Christopher started it off that we're always ready to learn every

576
00:38:19,680 --> 00:38:23,640
time we have you on the show and you know, today was no exception.

577
00:38:23,640 --> 00:38:29,080
Thank you for everything you invested into everything you prepared for this episode because

578
00:38:29,080 --> 00:38:31,240
it was a very special one.

579
00:38:31,240 --> 00:38:35,360
And I want other people to know that you are available.

580
00:38:35,360 --> 00:38:37,280
So let us know how that worked.

581
00:38:37,280 --> 00:38:38,280
Sure.

582
00:38:38,280 --> 00:38:41,520
You can find me at my website, tea and smoke.com.

583
00:38:41,520 --> 00:38:45,400
I'm also on Facebook and Instagram as Rissa Miller.

584
00:38:45,400 --> 00:38:46,400
Fantastic.

585
00:38:46,400 --> 00:38:51,440
Simple, sweet, love it.

586
00:38:51,440 --> 00:38:53,200
And you have been listening too.

587
00:38:53,200 --> 00:38:54,200
The Virgin.

588
00:38:54,200 --> 00:38:55,200
And the Beauty.

589
00:38:55,200 --> 00:38:59,560
And the Bitch in the BITCH year of the Bitch.

590
00:38:59,560 --> 00:39:03,080
Yes, find us like us, share us.

591
00:39:03,080 --> 00:39:04,080
Please come on back.

592
00:39:04,080 --> 00:39:05,920
Bring lots of people with you.

593
00:39:05,920 --> 00:39:11,480
To become a partner in the BBB community, we invite you to find us at Virgin.

594
00:39:11,480 --> 00:39:14,400
BeautyBitch.com.

595
00:39:14,400 --> 00:39:18,600
Like us on Facebook, Instagram and LinkedIn.

596
00:39:18,600 --> 00:39:25,200
And share us with people who are defiantly different like you.

597
00:39:25,200 --> 00:39:27,160
Until next time, thanks for listening.

598
00:39:27,160 --> 00:39:29,540
(upbeat music)